Team Focus - Come On In And Enjoy The Company! Home 
How To's Create A Ride TF Guest Map TF Merchandise TF Members Rides TF Toolbar Download Register

 Moderated by: teamfocus
New Topic Reply Print
Sludge - In The News - Off Topics - Team Focus - Come On In And Enjoy The Company!

 Not logged in  
 Login
 Register
 Home
 Calendar
 Members
 Help

Search
Search
Search by username

Recent Topics


AuthorPost
Mr. Versatile
TF Senior Moderator


Joined: Wed May 26th, 2004
Location: Ohio USA
Posts: 3211
Year/Model: '02 ZX3
Occupation: Special Ed Teacher
Interests: Cars, bicycle road racing, playing my sax.
Male/Female: Male
Status:  Offline
Mana: 
 Posted: Sun Jul 10th, 2005 04:07 am
QuoteReply












August 2005






















Sludge: Jumping through hoops to make a case








Some 4.7 million engines sold in the U.S. may be prone to developing sludge.
Photograph by Rocky Carr
A killer named sludge may live in your engine and can choke the life from your car, regardless of maintenance or mileage. And the automakers whose engines are susceptible to sludge still aren’t always eager to help.

Sludge often forms when oil oxidizes and breaks down after prolonged exposure to high temperatures. The baked oil turns gelatinous and can block vital oil passages, which could lead to repairs exceeding $8,000 or even an engine replacement.

While sludge often results from poor upkeep, notably not changing oil at prescribed intervals, some engines from Audi, Chrysler, Saab, Toyota, and Volkswagen appear prone to it (see the chart below).

The Center for Auto Safety says it has received about 1,300 sludge complaints since 2004. Toyota, the company with the most engines in question, cited 3,400 complaints through 2002 but hasn’t provided an updated number since. And while about 4.7 million engines sold in the U.S. may have sludge-prone designs, the problem rate as reflected in our reliability data is very low. But that’s little solace to those affected by it.

The automakers initially blamed these concerns on poor care and resisted covering repair costs. However, all but Chrysler have begun replacement or repair programs, even for those who bought their vehicles used. Chrysler says it will handle sludge complaints individually.


AUTOMAKERS play tough

These programs put the burden of proof on the owner, however. While Toyota, Lexus, Audi, Saab, and Volkswagen have extended engine coverage to eight years from the original purchase, the deals come with fine print.

Volkswagen’s policy requires that customers produce all oil-change records. Saab will repair or replace its engines only after its own maintenance review, and Toyota asks for proof of at least one oil change a year.

Those conditions would require attentive record-keeping for original owners, but it could cause headaches for used-vehicle owners.Even with the extended engine warranties, some consumers are denied repair compensation when they first approach the manufacturer.

When Sarah Bolek’s 2001 Volkswagen Passat hit 59,000 miles in 2004, the engine succumbed to sludge. The repair estimate was $9,000, says Bolek, who lives in Boyds, Md.

Despite the warranty, Volkswagen originally turned down her reimbursement request. The automaker objected to two oil changes because a shop had not recorded the vehicle’s mileage. Still, all the oil changes were within recommended intervals.

“They kept telling me it was my fault,” Bolek says. Meanwhile the car was out of service for four months.

When contacted by CR, the company said that it was investigating Bolek’s claim and that it had paid for part of the repair. A week later, it picked up the balance of Bolek’s bill.

Clarence Ditlow, executive director of the Center for Auto Safety, says consumers must be persistent with dealers and manufacturers concerning sludge. “Too few consumers complain beyond the dealer,” he says. “Manufacturers know that every hurdle they create will make more consumers drop out.”


HOW TO FIGHT SLUDGE

Consumer Reports urges vehicle owners to keep thorough records of their automobile maintenance and repairs and make sure all receipts contain the date, mileage, and vehicle identification number.

CR also recommends that owners of vehicles with sludge-prone engines use an American Petroleum Institute-approved synthetic motor oil or change oil according to the “extreme use” schedule in the vehicle’s manual.

Synthetics have a higher tolerance for extreme heat and flow better in cold temperatures. When using any oil, be sure it meets manufacturer viscosity guidelines.

Changing oil on the extreme use schedule (and saving the records) provides evidence that you tried to protect the engine from sludge.

Used-car buyers considering those vehicles should locate one with complete maintenance records.








Engines in questionsubscribe today and have access to all of ConsumerReports.org.









____________________
If you can't read this, you're illiterate.
Back To Top QuoteReply

lil duratec
TF Family Member


Joined: Sun Feb 6th, 2005
Location: Morgantown, West Virginia USA
Posts: 842
Year/Model: 
Occupation: Medical Student
Interests: 
Male/Female: 
Status:  Offline
Mana: 
 Posted: Sun Jul 10th, 2005 05:28 am
QuoteReply
Interesting article. I'd be pretty upset if I had to pay for synthetics and replace them every 3k (extreme use) anyways, jsut in case the engine wanted to get sludgy? It jsut seems like a lot of wasted money and oil, since most of it would probably come out still fresh... but I guess that's cheaper than a new engine?

And if I may be spiteful for a moment: hahahahaha, the invincible Toyota is prone to something? No domestic companies' engines seem to have this "sludge" rep!? Um, except Dodge, who I've seen have engine issues on the cars mentioned in the linked table!   /end spite

I have nothing against the foreign cars, and I like many of them but god I really HATE that the general public frowns upon Ford, GM, Chevy as being domestic and so automatically crap. All my family drives are Fords or other American companies, and I've never seen a car die out with proper maintenance... we've never caught a lemon I guess.

It's just annoying is all, I hate when people jump to conclusions when obviously all cars can be reliable and all cars can have troubles. Sorry Mr. V for hijacking your News thread, I know I'd never heard this before?

Last edited on Sun Jul 10th, 2005 05:35 am by lil duratec



____________________
~Amanda~
Back To Top QuoteReply

Chelly03PZEV
TF Administrator


Joined: Wed May 26th, 2004
Location: Always On The Ocean, Maine USA
Posts: 3590
Year/Model: 2003 2.3 PZEV ...
Occupation: Broadband Technical Support Rep
Interests: Focus & Cars in General - Dogs (animals) - many ...
Male/Female: Female
Status:  Offline
Mana: 
 Posted: Sun Jul 10th, 2005 02:06 pm
QuoteReply
If you are following the recommended change intervals with the conventional oils, you should not have a problem with sludging.

Secondly, as this article states with the synthetics, keep records and provide proof of the claims of the high endurance, longer drain interval synthetics.  I keep extreme records on my car for every little thing I buy for it etc.

I have a little notebook in my car that stays in my car for all maintenance.  It really doesn't take much to keep good records. 

As for the propencity of some cars over others to sludge more than others...I'd take into account the 'types' of drivers who own these vehicles.  Are they the type that don't change when they should as regularly as they should?  Do they actually check their tire pressure and oil levels once a week as they should?  Dan and I rec' CR as well and I take some of their comments with a grain of salt because you really have no idea the test groups or groups of those who complained or gave reviews and their reliability...I feel the same with all surveys or test results.  You really need to take into account all of the circumstances.



____________________
Get in, Sit down, Shut up and HANG ON!
Back To Top QuoteReply

Current time is 01:49 am
Team Focus - Come On In And Enjoy The Company! > Off Topics > In The News > Sludge


Arctic2 theme designed by: The Cat Dragged Inn
Powered by WowBB 1.7 - Copyright © 2003-2006 Aycan Gulez
Page processed in 0.2468 seconds (18% database + 82% PHP). 18 queries executed.